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Anonymous
Unregistered

To The Body
      #44191 - 11/18/02 11:52 AM

I am so sick of these dissidents postings as I'm sure are several other people. I thought this board was for people who want to share ideas and ask questions about HIV treatment and so on.
To stop all this crap, why not put up a forum for dissidents and not allow any of their crap postings on this forum. Then if someone,like Karla, wants to converse with them they will have their own forum.
This will solve everything and make a lot of people happy!
What do you think?



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Anonymous
Unregistered

Re: To The Body - I agree new
      #44196 - 11/18/02 02:09 PM

Give the disidents a forum on here where they can post. Put whatever disclamer thebody feels appropriate saying that the views of the posting members are not endorced by thebody. It is valuable to be able to see different ways of thinking. My only complaint over the disidents is the way they hi-jack forums and threaten to hold them hostage unles their demands are met.

By giving them a place to post and letting them know they are not allowed to post their long winded articles in other forums it gives the best of both worlds and a compromise that I think that most everyone can live with.

Just my opinion for what it's worth



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Anonymous
Unregistered

Re: To The Body - I agree new
      #44197 - 11/18/02 02:16 PM

They're practicing a form of terrorism and they should stop. I agree, give them their own forum and take them off of these.



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Anonymous
Unregistered

Re: To The Body - I disagree new
      #44199 - 11/18/02 02:43 PM

Do you really think that they will stay in only one forum? They want to be disruptive. They enjoy butting into every conversation and offering their unwanted opinions.



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Dave Brader
Unregistered

Re: To The Body new
      #44203 - 11/18/02 04:01 PM

Giving them an area of their own to post in has not worked at several other sites. That was tried at ABOUT.COM, and of course the DENIALISTS continued to try and disrupt the webboard by posting in every section of the forum. Here is a post from Kelly Jon Boy Landis at Virusmyth. The minute they think they are having an effect he always asks more of them to come and join in........

"Keep up the good work. Or if you haven't posted before, take a look at the posts we are making, some anonymously, some with our real names, like me. There are a number of AIDS message boards Dissidents are active on and this monumental effort is slowly turning the tide.

LINK to THE BODY's FORUM(S)


The only way to stop them, is to block them or censor them, the same way they do the orthodox posters who try to post at their sites.

Dave Brader



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Dave Brader
Unregistered

Re: To The Body - I agree new
      #44204 - 11/18/02 04:05 PM

Go to the webboard at VIRUSMYTH.com and post to them there. There are several great threads there were they look so foolish at worst you will have a good laugh, and at best you can see their DENIALIST mentality so you can respond better to their BS here.

Dave Brader



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Dave Brader
Unregistered

Re: To The Body new
      #44207 - 11/18/02 04:22 PM

Ask them to tell you about JACK LEVINE. He was a DENIALIST who posted regularly at VIRUSMYTH for a couple of years. He used to tell me how the meds are killing me, and he was so much healthier than me because he did not take them. But Guess what? JACK LEVINE died last April of AIDS, and I am still here taking those medications for over four years now!! LMAO LMAO

The DENIALISTS are killing people with their BS. Do everything in your power to silence them. They are very sick people. Most of them suffer from Paranoid Schizophrenia. They killed JACK LEVINE with this nonsense. He damned them from his deathbed, and said he wished he has never heard of DENIALISTS.

Dave Brader



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Dave Brader
Unregistered

Re: To The Body new
      #44208 - 11/18/02 04:27 PM

As it stands right now, it would be better for THE BODY to shut this forum down than to let it continue like this. These people have no concern for the lives or health of others. They are doing more harm than if there was no forum here at all. Close it down. People can go to ABOUT.COM and discuss the real issues. The DENIALISTS are locked out of that forum. If you have no way to lock them out here, just shut the forum down.

Dave Brader



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Juliekay
Unregistered

Re: To The Body - I agree new
      #44220 - 11/18/02 06:34 PM

I think the dissidents are only acting in defense to being banned and removed. The Body started a flame war with them and so the board is in chaos now. I think all people should be able to post where they wish and I don't like separation because we live in a melting pot society with people with many views and backgrounds.



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gregg629
Guardian

Reged: 04/16/01
Posts: 438
Loc: Boston
I DISAGREE new
      #44230 - 11/18/02 08:38 PM

Juliekay,

Acting in defense????? You think they should be allowed to post in here saying things like "don't use condoms," "Have sex without guilt" "don't worry who you infect because HIV is only a myth" "don't take meds, you'll live longer".

Free speech is one thing, and having a melting pot society is all fine and good, but these dissidents are going beyond free speech, they are acting in a criminal way. People come to this board a lot of times because they are concerned about having contracted HIV, they are trying to learn about it. Teens come here because they don't feel they can turn to their parents or teachers.

What message do you want to give them? The body is not a public forum, it's a private space for those seeking support for this disease. What your asking for (and accusing the body of starting flame war) is no different then expecting a Jewish synagogue to allow a bunch of skinheads to be allowed to post their hate messages on their Bulletin Boards. Then blaming them for causing a problem by saying your not welcome to post here.

I feel your heart is in the right place with your thoughts, but your missing the point. As the dissidents say, they have tons of boards out there where they post their "beliefs". They only post in here because they are terrorists who threaten if they don't get their way.

They do not have any business posting in here.

Gregg629



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Jeanne Hatfield
Unregistered

Re: To The Body - I agree new
      #44314 - 11/20/02 04:36 AM

Self defense????????? That is a rather bizarre take on the "dissidents". This site belongs to the body. If they choose to delete posts or block someone they have every right. The problem with allowing dissidents to post is that they give out their opinions as if they were fact. You cannot ignore someone when you know they may be talking to anyone - including a newly diagnosed confused and scared person. The drivel they post is born of ignorance and the desperate need to be recognized. The cries of persecution are fabricated. No doubt there are only about a half dozen online but it only takes one to deliberately lie and create "facts" to support their agenda - which is making themselves appear as concerned and knowledgable. In reality they are desperate for places to post their bullshit because they have been blocked from virtually every group and board on the net. People who routinely lie and intentionally harm others are despicable and in no way can their actions be cloaked as self defense.
Jeanne



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Anonymous
Unregistered

Re: To The Body - I agree new
      #44330 - 11/20/02 02:56 PM

"The problem with allowing dissidents to post is that they give out their opinions as if they were fact."

Jeanne and Everyone,

This point that Jeanne made cannot be emphasized enough. I was diagnosed a little over a year ago and started to get sucked into Denialist crap until, after spending a good deal of time with it, it became abundantly obvious that their stock-in-trade is rhetoric and misinformation. Their way of dealing with cold hard facts from reliable sources is generally to ignore these data. The last thing they are interested in is dialogue and deserve no voice whatsoever in support forums such as this one.



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Anonymous
Unregistered

Re: To The Body - I agree new
      #44355 - 11/20/02 04:50 PM

"I was diagnosed a little over a year ago and started to get sucked into Denialist crap until, after spending a good deal of time with it, it became abundantly obvious that their stock-in-trade is rhetoric and misinformation"

And thank God you woke up to that FACT! You could easily have followed their BS and ended up dead like JACK LEVINE! There must always be someone willing to point out the DENIALIST rhetoric, half-truths and outright lies so that people like you are not endangered by their lies!! I will do my best to do so as long as I am alive. I never want to see another JACK LEVINE be led to their death by the DENIALISTS!

Dave Brader



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Anonymous
Unregistered

Re: To The Body - I agree new
      #44376 - 11/20/02 08:24 PM

Unfortunately, it does indeed seem too risky to all together ignore these folks. We'd like to believe that most people are not taken in, but newly positive people are especially vulnerable to Denialists'--and they ARE Denialists, NOT dissidents--nonsense. Who of us does not want our HIV diagnosis to be meaningless after all?

But once you get to the point of seeing their deception, total disregard of the facts, ignoring direct questions that speak to the facts (and which are a part of a "dialogue" they claim to want), manipulation of data, misuse of citations, and on and on firsthand, it becomes too easy to see just how pathetic they are.

One of the best examples, Dave, is their treatment of your own story, which I know you do not repeat often. You presented with PCP after many years of not knowing you were infected and are now doing quite well four years later on HAART. This would not have been the case ten years ago as we all know. Yours is one of many similar stories, but somehow this is of little consequence to Denialists.

And of course it isn't enough for them to do as they see fit on an individual level. Sinister as it is, they have some sick urge to spread their propaganda and would rather we all wait until we come down with a serious OI first, as you did, and take our chances with death before taking those "poisons."

I have no doubts you're right, Dave, about the importance of challenging them as long as they're around, especially when they start popping up on boards such as this one. But what a pity it is for any of us to have to expend our time and energy in this way because of a few morons out there who either don't understand the implications of their actions, or do not care.



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Dave Brader
Unregistered

Re: To The Body - I agree new
      #44384 - 11/20/02 10:28 PM

Since I don't get out as often as I used to and spend a lot of time on the computer, I have come to actually look forward to confronting them when they start their little acts. I am often not greeted well when I enter a forum they are attacking as my methods are quite nasty to stay the least. I don't mince words, and I certainly am not about being polite to them. I remember when Kelly Jon Boy Landis first started his campaign at ABOUT.COM. I had never been to that forum before, just as you have never seen me post here before. But when I follow these pathetic losers to their game playing I go after them with all I have. I have lots of information about them, and that is one of the reasons they stay anonymous. I can be even more effective when I know exactly who is posting. Most of them have admitted serious psychologial problems at one time or another during their mutual gratifications sessions at VIRUSMYTH! LMAO

Anyway, I now consider that it is my responsiblity to follow them as I do. And not intending to blow my own horn, but I am very effective at shutting them up. As you can see, they have backed off quite a bit here already. Only one of them has really posted anything for a couple of days now. Jeanne Hatfield complained about me often when I first showed up at ABOUT.COM to battle the DENIALISTS when they went there, but I am sure she has seen now how they work, and how there is only one way to shut them up, and it certainly is not by being polite and trying to debate them rationally. That is impossible, because there is not one of them that is rational in any way!

Dave Brader



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