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Barbackers now joining..
      #47833 - 12/09/02 06:28 AM

There are many people who consider themselves "barebackers" who are joing the AIDS dissident movement. Some even believe that hiv causes AIDS. They are fed up with being censored.

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Re: Barbackers now joining.. new
      #47837 - 12/09/02 06:41 AM

Barebacking is just good old natural sex. We do not come with a toxic condom on our dicks. How can something with 3 carcinogens and 41 toxins (on the FDA list) be safe. It makes no sense.

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Re: Barbackers now joining.. new
      #47842 - 12/09/02 07:04 AM

Barebackers and "denialists" are both the same. Completely selfish guys who don't want to wear condoms yet come up with different reasons...And both are completely inconsiderate of others. You can see on this board how the denialsts just post repeatedly unconcerned if they are wanted in this conversation or not. They have such self-importance they think they are being censored for their theories...That's a laugh. They have no reasonable theories. I think they are being deleted because they are adding nothing to the conversation. They are like roaches.

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Re: Barbackers now joining.. new
      #47848 - 12/09/02 07:18 AM

I love that these barebackers and denialists claim they know something about this subject. They are so completely delusional and so unintelligent! Yikes! I mean to be advocating barebacking is so ridiculous.

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Re: Barbackers now joining.. new
      #47863 - 12/09/02 08:06 AM


The Hard Core porn industry in America has 20,000 full time actors and actresses, plus
double that number of 'Pro-Am' part time performers. Many male performers appear in
both straight and gay productions. Many female performers also work as 'escorts' and there
is a 'line of contact' between almost everyone in the industry.

Less then thirty percent of productions use condoms and almost none did until four years
ago. Some performers have made as many as 1,800 films (see the Adult Video News
(AVN) yearly statistics) with three or four 'sex acts' per film.

All this should, if AIDS is a sexually transmitted disease, mean that 'Porn Stars' are dying
by the hundreds of AIDS. The truth is there has only been one confirmed death in twenty
years attributed to 'AIDS' and he (John Holmes) was an IV drugs user.

Heroin is an extreme immune suppressant as any medical book will tell you. To claim John
Holmes as an 'AIDS' death ignores the immune suppressant effects of the drugs he was

There have been many false alarms (due to false positive tests) but NOT one confirmed
female case of 'AIDS'.


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Do Barebackers Smoke? new
      #47901 - 12/09/02 02:20 PM

It cracks me up how to prove a case you quote 3 carcinogens and 41 toxins in condoms as your reason for not using them, however a good percentage of you will puff on a cigarette which contains much more then that and has been PROVEN to KILL.

It just doesn’t make sense to me???

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Hypocrite new
      #47908 - 12/09/02 04:09 PM

Dissident is spelled Hypocrite

The same dissidents who post on here crying about being censored are also the same ones who’s web sites don’t allow anyone to post unless they first register and sign an agreement saying that they don’t believe that HIV causes AIDS. If anyone after registering posts anything that the web sites disagree with, their posts are deleted and the registered user is banned.

The only reason why these losers come here and try to post is because they can hide behind the anonymous screen names, very similar to other groups who hide behind masks.

They post misleading facts while trying to support a case which they can’t prove. They are criminally negligent in trying to encourage people to have unprotected sex. Most of them are in fact HIV positive and continue to spread the disease by saying “there’s no disease so I can’t spread it by having unsafe sex with someone”.

Again, Dissident is spelled Hypocrite

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Hundreds of porn stars with aids new
      #47909 - 12/09/02 04:09 PM

There are hundreds of porn stars who've died of aids. Hundreds more are hiv pos. The list of the aids deaths of porn stars is everywhere. You havn't seen it because you live under a rock.

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Short list of Porn Stars with HIV/Aids or Dead new
      #47929 - 12/09/02 07:02 PM

The following porn stars tested positive for HIV:
Caroline, Brooke Ashley and Tricia Devereaux. Veteran male performer Marc Wallice is widely thought to be the source of infection for everyone in 1998 (having engaged on camera in unprotected anal sex with the infected girls), and possibly Nena Cherry (2/97), Jordan McKnight (5/97), and French girls Delfin (6/97?) and Barbara Doll (5/95) in past years.

In 1999, Tony Montana and a Florida female performer tested HIV positive. On January 18, 2000, Niki Lae tested HIV positive. In January, 2001, black female Tori Coca Flame tested HIV positive.

At a February fourth, 1998 talent meeting, Tricia Devereaux told her peers that she had tested HIV positive in early January. Then Sharon Mitchell told the crowd of 200 that virtually everybody had been exposed the HIV virus, and that the then-current Eliza test was no longer considered suitable. The industry standard was now the PCR-DNA test for HIV.

On March 27, Brooke Ashley tested HIV positive, after turning in a "50-man anal gangbang" in late January and early February, where she worked with Wallice.

In early April, Caroline tested HIV positive followed by Wallice April 30. Wallice's test revealed that he had probably been HIV positive for a year or so.

On May 29, Kimberly Jade tested HIV positive. She worked with Marc in late 1997. Her test revealed that she had been HIV positive for about six months.

Responding to the latest HIV outbreak in the heterosexual porn industry, industry powers like VCA, Vivid, Wicked and distributors like GVA in an April 13, 1998 meeting demanded use of condoms in their productions.

Other Porn stars who had or have HIV
John Holmes, R.J. Reynolds, Wade Nichols (shot himself in 1985 while dying of AIDS), Marc Stevens, Wade Nichols (according to reports) and Chuck Vincent died of AIDS in the mid to late '80s. Lisa (Trego) DeLeeuw died of AIDS at age 35 on 11-11-93.

A porn performer named Dusty disappeared in November 1992 and is widely thought to have tested HIV positive. Carrie Morgan left the industry in Spring 1993 for similar reason. France's Barbara Doll left in April 1995.

Here's a list of porn stars who died of AIDS --
Brad Braverman AIDS 1/10/96

Zeff Ryan AIDS 1/94 aka Jeff Ryan

Bill Harrison AIDS 10/18/91

Craig Markle AIDS 10/93

Paul Pellettieri AIDS 10/93

Lisa de Leeuw AIDS 11/11/93

Chris Ladd AIDS 11/14/90

Scott Taylor AIDS 12/22/94

Marc Stevens AIDS 1989

Morelle AIDS 1994 pre-op transsexual DeKeigh

Joey Yale AIDS 1994

Steve AIDS 1995-97 aka Luke Bender;
Kennedy Exact date of death unknown

Buster AIDS 2/10/91

Scott O'Hara AIDS, lymphnoma 2/18/98

Frank AIDS 2/24/91 aka Roger Koch

Jason Steele AIDS 2/25/95

Chris Burns AIDS 2/26/95

Lucky Luc AIDS 3/2/92

Chet Thomas AIDS 3/23/97

Tim Kramer AIDS 4/15/92

Christopher AIDS 4/24/91 aka Frederick
Rage Mongue

Roy Garret AIDS 4/3/92

Luc Colton AIDS 5/18/93

Brad Peters AIDS 5/31/94

Clint AIDS 6/17/93

Luke AIDS 6/20/89

Lee Ryder AIDS 7/10/91

Darryl Weld AIDS 7/24/91

Johnny AIDS 7/25/89

Tony Bravo AIDS 7/25/90 aka Michael Pietri

Jeff AIDS 7/31/94

Pierce AIDS 7/8/95

Glenn Dime AIDS 8/12/92

Al Parker AIDS 8/17/92

Chris AIDS 9/11/91

Steve Kreig AIDS 9/13/90 aka Steve Craig,
George Dufour

Lon Flexx AIDS 9/15/95

Glenn Steers AIDS 9/17/94

Nick Elliot AIDS 9/2/90 renowned

Richard Locke AIDS 9/25/96

Jake Corbin AIDS 9/27/92

Ben Barker AIDS 9/28/95

Keith Ardent AIDS 9/9/92

Jim Ed AIDS Unknown

Jim Moore AIDS Unknown

Joe Simmons AIDS complications Unknown

Jesse Koehler AIDS Unknown

Jaap Penrat AIDS Unknown

J.W. King AIDS Unknown

Eric Stryker AIDS Unknown

Dave Connors AIDS Exact Date Unknown

Casey AIDS Exact Date Unknown

Arthur AIDS Exact Date Unknown
Bressan, Jr.

Eric Stone AIDS Exact Date Unknown

Rydar Hanson AIDS Exact Date Unknown

Jon King AIDS Exact Date Unknown

Val Martin AIDS Exact Date Unknown

Ken Diamond AIDS Exact Date Unknown

Thom Katt AIDS Unknown appeared in such
films as CULT

Steve Taylor AIDS Exact Date Unknown

Steve Loignon AIDS Exact Date Unknown

Lee Richards AIDS Exact Date Unknown

Scott Bond AIDS complications Exact Date Unknown

John Holmes Cardiac arrest, Exact Date Unknown
enephalitis and AIDS

Nick Rogers AIDS Exact Date Unknown

Wade Nichols Self-inflicted gunshot 1985 Allegedly to save himself from the ravages of AIDS

Rod Phillips Suicide by drug OD 6/7/93
as he lay dying of AIDS

All of the above has been documented in the porn industry and all were before the medications...

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Re: Barbackers now joining.. new
      #47934 - 12/09/02 08:49 PM

Yeah, like why would selfish, inconsiderate men want to put anything on their precious little organs...Could ruin the thing. I hope you get every std in the book. What dickheads.

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Re: Barbackers now joining.. new
      #47949 - 12/09/02 09:41 PM


A paper in the February 1992 issue of Applied and Environmental Microbiology reports that filtration techniques show the HIV-1 virus to
be 0.1 micron (4 millionths of an inch) in diameter. It is three times smaller than the herpes virus, 60 times smaller than the syphilis
spirochete, and 50 to 450 times smaller than sperm. (8)


Naval Research Laboratory (NRL) researchers, using powerful electron microscopes, have found that new latex, from which condoms are
fabricated, contains "maximum inherent flaw[s]" (that is, holes) 70 microns in diameter. (9)

These holes are 700 times larger than the HIV-1 virus. There are pores in latex, and some of the pores are large enough to pass sperm-sized
particles. Carey, et al., observed leakage of HIV-sized particles through 33%+ of the latex condoms tested. In addition, as Gordon points
out in his review, the testing procedures for condoms are less than desirable. United States condom manufacturers are allowed 0.4% leaky
condoms (AQL). Gordon states, "The fluctuations in sampling permits many batches not meeting AQL to be sold." In the United States,
12% of domestic and 21% of imported batches of condoms have failed to meet the 0.4% AQL. (10)


In a 1988 study sponsored by the National Institutes of Health, Bruce Voeller of the Mariposa Foundation in Topanga, California, a
non-profit organization dedicated to preventing the spread of sexually transmitted diseases, ranked 31 brands of latex condoms according to
how well they met the U.S. and international quality assurance standards designed to ensure that condoms provide an effective barrier
against human sperm.

"Many of the condoms now on the market would not get FDA approval if they were required to meet today’s standards," says Voeller.
Although all condoms sold in the U.S.are supposed to pass quality assurance tests, those marketed before 1976 need not meet the more
stringent requirements necessary to win FDA marketing approval. (11)

Dr. Collart reports that "Gotszche and Hording in their study of in vivo [real life] condom failure rates concluded ‘Condoms to prevent
HIV transmission do not imply truly safe sex.’ In addition Steiner, et al., observed newer lots of condoms had actual breakage rates of
3.5-8.8%, while actual breakage rates for older lots ranged from 9.8-18.6%. In a study conducted by Ahmed, et al., 29%-42% of those who
had used condoms experienced at least one breakage. In a survey conducted by the University of Manchester, 52% of those who had
obtained condoms from their family planning clinic had one or more either burst or slip off in the 3 months before the survey. In studies by Albert, et al., and by Wright, et al., 36% and 38% of their respondents reported condom failures respectively." (12)


Some have advocated the use of spermicide containing nonoxynol-9 in the prevention of HIV infection. However, the protective effects of
nonoxynol-9 have not been established in vivo for any of the viral STDs. Some reports suggest that spermicides (including nonoxynol-9)
may be associated with irritation and ulceration of genital and rectal epithelia, side-effects that may actually facilitate HIV infection. In a study with Nairobi prostitutes, a higher rate of new HIV infections was found among women using nonoxynol-9 than among those not
using it. Additionally, in a study of rhesus monkeys who were exposed to a high dose of simian immunodeficiency virus following
vaginally inserted nonoxynol-9 foam, half the monkeys developed an infection. (13, 14, 15, 16)


Condoms are sensitive to heat and cold, yet they are not normally transported in climate-controlled vehicles. Vesey, in his study of condoms,checked 72,000 trucks and has actual photographs of eggs frying in the backs of trucks used for condom distribution.

Partly due to Vesey’s study, Burlington County, NJ, banned the distribution of condoms at the county’s AIDS counselling center, because they concluded that the risk of liability for condom failures was too great. (17)


In a 1990 review article by April and Schreiner, the authors summarize recent studies on HIV infection and conclude, "Recent studies on HIV prevention show the assumption that condoms provide reliable protection against HIV to be a dangerous illusion." The studies reviewed by the authors showed that the rate of seroconversion (HIV infection) associated with condom use ranged from 13% to 27% and
more. (18)

Frosner concludes that "Available data now indicate that efficacy of condoms has been largely overestimated." (19)

In a study in Florida, where heterosexual couples used condoms, 17% of partners of AIDS patients became infected within 18 months, (20)
despite the frequency of sexual relations being lower if one partner is HIV-positive.(21) Detels, et al., (22) observed a risk reduction of only 3.3:1 for those who used condoms with all of their partners, and a 1.8:1 increase in riskfor those who used condoms for some of their partners as opposed to using condoms for none of their partners. This would indicate that condoms are ineffective for prolonged or lifelong protection from AIDS. (23)

In addition, since 100% condom use is difficult if not impossible to obtain, the realistic number to look at would be the risk while using condoms some of the time. It is more realistic to expect teens to be abstinent (which is 100% effective in preventing sexual transmission of HIV) than it is to expect them to use condoms 100% of the time (which has an HIV failure rate approaching 100% with life-long use.) Joffe, et al., (24) state: "The association between categories of condom use and history of an STD were not statistically significant at
conventional levels after adjustment for number of partners."

Cohen, et al., (25) conducted a study in which patients who had contracted an STD were given a condom education course. Within nine
months "19.9% of the men and 12.6% of the women returned with new STD," some multiple times. The STD reinfection rate actually increased for women. Frosner states the U.S. government has withdrawn a $2.6 million grant to study condoms because "An unacceptably high number of condom users probably would have been infected in such a study." He adds that the only safe sex is mutually monogamous and between two non-infected persons. (26)


The United States Public Health Service states that sexual relations, even with a condom, with a person who is HIV-positive is so risky that alternative methods of expressing physical intimacy should be considered. Additionally, Public Health Services warns that the rate of HIV transmission in anal intercourse is so high that the practice should be avoided. (27)


In conclusion, Herbert Ratner, M.D., offers the best summary of all when he says,

Actually, the major accomplishment of the condom campaign to prevent AIDS is to impress the promoters, politicians and the public at large that something is being done; and although well-intentioned, it offers more of a placebo than a panacea.

Publicizing the condom to the four winds is, for the most part, the bravura of a puritan who is trying to prove to the world
that he is not a puritan. To concentrate on the mechanical aspects of the sex act to the exclusion of the emotional and psychological aspects (which the condom campaign ignores) is the essence of Puritanism. The only difference between the new and the old is that whereas the traditional puritans were alleged to believe that sex was something to be isolated and repressed, neo-puritans accept sex as something to be isolated and exercised. (28)

Reviewed by Joel McIlhaney, M.D., of the Medical Institute for Sexual Health


1.Weller, Susan C., "A Meta-Analysis of Condom Effectiveness in Reducing Sexually Transmitted HIV," Social Science and Medicine, Vol. 36, #12, June 1993, pp. 1635-1644.

2.Smith, Richard W., The Condom: Is It Really Safe Sex? (unpublished, October 1990) pp. 8-9.

3.Collart, David G., M.D., Condom Failure for Protection From Sexual Transmission of the HIV: A Review of the Medical Literature, Feb. 16 1993.

4.Zenilman, Jonathan, et al., "Condom Use to Prevent Incident STDs: The Validity of Self-Reported Condom Use," Sexually Transmitted Diseases, Jan.-Feb. 1995, pp.15-21;

5.Ravenel S. duBose, M.D., "Comments and Observations," Aug. 5, 1995.

6.Joel McIlhaney, Jr., M.D., "Chlamydia Trachomatis; The Most Common Bacterial Sexually Transmitted Disease in the United States," Medical Institute for Sexual Health Sexual Health Update, Vol. 3, #3, Fall, 1995.
7.Friedman and Trivelli, "Condom Availability for Youth: A High Risk Alternative," Pediatrics, 2/97, p. 285.

8.Lytle, C. D., et al., "Filtration Sizes of Human Immunodeficiency Virus Type 1 and Surrogate Viruses Used to Test Barrier Materials," Applied and Environmental Microbiology, Vol. 58, #2, Feb. 1992.

9."Anomalous Fatigue Behavior in Polysoprene," Rubber Chemistry and Technology, Vol. 62, #4, Sep.-Oct. 1989.

10.Collart, David G., M.D., loc. cit.

11.Nowak, Rachel, "Research Reveals Condom Conundrums," The Journal of NIH Research, Vol. 5, Jan. 1993, pp. 32, 33.

12.Collart, David G., M.D., op. cit.

13.Bird, K.D., AIDS, Vol. 5, pp. 791-796, 1991.

14.Voeller, B., AIDS, Vol. 6, pp. 341-342, 1992.

15.Kreiss, J.; Ruminjo, I.; Ngugi, E.; Roberts, P.; Ndinya-Achola, J.; and Plummer, F., 1989 V International Conference on AIDS, Montreal.

16.Miller, C.J.; Alexander, N.J.; Sutjipto, S.; et al., J. Med. Primatol, Vol. 19, pp. 401-409, 1990.

17.Vesey, W.B., HLI Reports, Vol. 9, pp. 1-4, 1991.

18.April, K., and Schreiner, W., Schweiz. med. Wschr., Vol. 120, pp. 972-978, 1990.

19.Frosner, G.G., 1989, Infection, Vol. 17, pp. 1-3.

20.Fischl, M.A.; Dickinson, G.M.; Segsl, A.; Flanagan, S.; and Rodriguez, M.; Presentation THP. 92, III International Conference on
AIDS in Washington D.C., 1-5 June, p. 178, 1987.

21.Klimes, I., et al., AIDS Care, Vol. 4, p. 151, 1992.

22.Detels, R.; English, P.; Visscher, B.R.; Jacobson, L.; Kingsley, L.A.; Chmiel, J.S.; Dudley, J.P.; Eldred, L.J.; and Ginzburg, H.M.;Journal of Acquired Immune Deficiency Syndromes, Vol. 2, pp. 77-83, 1989.

23.Gordon, R., loc. cit.

24.Joffe, G.P.; Foxman, B.; Schmidt, A.J.; Farris, K.B.; Carter, R.J.; Neumann, S.; Tolo, K.-A.; and Walters, A.M.; 1992, Sexually Transmitted Diseases, Vol. 19, pp. 272-278.

25.Cohen, D.A.; Dent, C.; MacKinnon, D.; and Hahn, G.; Sexually Transmitted Diseases, Vol. 19, pp. 245-251, 1992.

26.Frösner, G.G., loc. cit.

27.Byer, C.O., and Shainberg, L.W., Dimensions of Human Sexuality, Wm. C. Brown Publishers, 1991.

28.Ratner, Herbert, M.D., "Condoms and AIDS," ALL About Issues, Feb. 1989, p. 36.

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      #47958 - 12/09/02 09:50 PM

You write:

"A paper in the February 1992"
"In a 1988 study"
"In a 1990 review article"

And unless I missed a date in your notes everything there is from 1987 - 1997. Do you think that anything at all has changed in the last few years? Don't you believe in the new things and ideas that medical research have brought to the world?

Why is it that you don't have anything more rescent then 5 years ago???


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Short list of Porn Stars new
      #47966 - 12/09/02 10:32 PM

Denialists will deny even this. They see the world in such narrow terms that they have clippings lying also about this...It's astonishing to witness such capability for delusion. But they cannot hear any other point of view. They are absolutely right. Everyone who disagrees with them are wrong. Don't you get it. ANd they will never change their opinion no matter how much proof you get. Imagine, they can't believe hemophiliacs got HIV from blood! And they promote barebacking! I mean even if HIV is hard for heterosexual males to get from women you can easily get herpes, hpv, etc from unprotected sex. Also the porn industry has not allied itself at all with these misfits. They have fundraisers all the time for AIDS organizations. Most would have nothing to do with these morons. Just look at the cat houses in NEvada. They have mandatory testing for stds weekly and HIV monthly. And you cannot have sex there without a condom. So ignore these fellows and their fantasies of unprotected sex. They are sad losers desperately searching for some meaning in their lives.

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