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Bug Chaser????
#27812 - 02/06/02 04:09 AM
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Could anyone shed light on something new to me? In reading things on this site and others, I've learned about something I had never heard of but sounds kind of scary. What exactly is a bug chaser and more, what drives them and why?
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gregg629
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Guardian
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Reged: 04/16/01
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Posts: 438
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Loc: Boston
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Tho I'm not a "bug chaser" or "gift giver" I was in a long term relationship with a bug chaser, tho it was not until our break up that I found out he was bug chassing.
A bug chaser is a person that for whatever reason wants to become positive. As to why or what goes through their twisted minds I'm not totally sure, but I feel it has to do with wanting to control things and not let things happen by chance. My ex was going out and having unprotected sex with as many guys as he could to try to become positive. I think he felt that if he was positive then he would have nothing to worry about and it would open up his life to all the positive people that didn't want to infect someone who was negative. I also think that he uses his being positive to get attention. Since I had no idea that he was bug chasing and since I thought our relationship was based on trust and love and since I loved him, I never used protection with him so basically I was an unfortunate side effect of his quest to become positive.
A "Gift Giver" is someone who is positive and is always on the lookout for guys to infect, sometimes without them knowing it and sometimes because they are bug chassing.
The person my ex left me for was another bug chasser and someone who he infected. They wear their HIV status like wedding rings, they feel it is something that they share with eachother, something that is special to the two of them and something that they will always have that no one can take away.
I hope that helps some. I know that my perception of the whole issue is kinda jaded and one sided, but that's because of the damage my ex's sick perversion has caused to my health. Don't get me wrong, I am still very healthy, I have been positive now for 4 years and on meds for 3.5 and undectable the entire time. I am probably in the best health of my life, but I am still HIV+.
Well let me know if that answers enough for you.
Take Care
Gregg
gregg629@aol.com
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Alot of these people who are 'bug chasers' are a part of the AIDS Cult. They have been brainwashed into using this language. Just like those who call themselves POZ and get off on the HIV anti-body positive label. They run around telling people they are HIV + or (POZ) and wear it like a badge of hounour. They are the ones that have glamourized it and so we have ither gay men thinking the 'POZ life' is freedom and not so bad. The ASO also tell everyone how "sucessfull" the AIDS drugs are and that AIDS is a "managble" disaese so people think that being hiv+ = freedom. They downplay the horrific side-effects as soemthing you just live with. Gregg if you were with a "bug chaser" for so many years and did not know it I find that hard to believe. Do you not know who you sleep with? Is that not your whole mo is that your suppose to know who you sleep with and protect yourself?
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gregg629
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Guardian
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Reged: 04/16/01
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Loc: Boston
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Hey, how's life over on AIDSrc?
Talk about being brainwashed. People like you have been brainwashed to use words like "AIDS Cult and Anti-body positive label. People like you run around saying that HIV and AIDS is not real and that everyone should have unprotected free 60's sex without worry.
As for my not knowing about my ex BF's bug chasing. Why is that so hard to believe. How many married couples have their relationships disolve when one partner finds out that the other has been leaving a seperate life. Sometimes it's a man and a woman and the woman finds out that the man is actually gay (oh, is that an acceptable label?) or the man finds out that the woman has been sleeping around behind his back. In my case my ex and I had what I thought was an agreement that in the event we played outside the relationship it would only be safe so we didn't bring back anything harmful to the other person. I trusted him to keep that agreement and to put my safety first. At first when we found out that he was positive and later when we found out that I was also I passed it off as an accident or something that was my fault for allowing the open relationship to take place. It was not until we broke up that I found both from him and from several of his friends that he had been trying very hard to find people whenever he could to have unsafe sex with. Those meeting that ran long at work, the quick sex during lunch breaks, who knows how many countless men while he was traveling were all done on purpose with the hopes that one of them would infect him.
Was I stupid to trust him. Yes. Do I feel I hold some of the blame, yes. Should I have only had save sex with him, probably, but those are all things in the past.
Am I better off now that we're not together, Definetly, am I healthy, YES. Am I suffering because of the meds that I take, NO. Does everyone do as well as I do with the meds, No.
I thought I knew who I was sleeping with. But he lied to me and used my trust and love against me.
Gregg
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NoTadissident
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Unregistered
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You assume I'm with AIDssrc or whatever. Your wrong! !Anyways sounds like your bitter and a bit of a victim. I don't buy the "I did not know he was cheating line" we all know on some level whats going on we just get use to living in denial. There are plenty of heterosexuals who don't buy the "ya gotta wear a condom everytime" deal and there is not "explosion" of AIDS in the heterosexual population (this is where you say but what about Africa, well differnet country and different definition of AIDS, we don't live in poverty and unsanitary conditions)despite the fact that this was predicted years ago. And your right "gay" is another label that we choose to use to describe ourselves and there are tons of young people who are questioning such labels. Your story is sad Gregg and I have compassion for you but its a victim story as well and many gays are taught to be victims and sometimes even encouraged by AIDS inc.. When your a victim you put all the responsibility on everthing outside of yourself. Things like virus and other people who "hurt you". Until you trust others and life I dout I or anyone else will convice you that life is on your side and you can trust sex as a healthy and natural experience.
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gregg629
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Guardian
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Reged: 04/16/01
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Posts: 438
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Loc: Boston
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NoTadissident... Now wouldn't that be a label? Or maybe it's an attempt at being labled, kinda grey zone I guess.
You might not be with AIDSrc but you most definetly come across like a dissident.
I take responsibility for what has happened in my life. Yes I knew my ex was playing around, HOWEVER I trusted him when he told me he was being safe and not taking risks with our lives. I life live without regrets, (and not having regret is different then being angry over things) because I am happy with who I am, so to me having regrets would mean that I am not happy with who I am. I'm not going to say that I'm not bitter and honestly I feel I have a right to be bitter, however my bitterness is for my ex and for the sick and twisted people out there who bug chase and gift give. I have had guys ask me to infect them and the thought repulses me. Now I know you feel why not have unsafe sex with them, there is nothing really like HIV so what would it matter. I disagree as to lots of Non-dissidents.
As for being the victim, Whie I can see how you can read that into the story my story is more told to make people aware that bug chasers and gife givers are out there and that they care more about infecting and becoming infected them they will about love and relationships. I have a good life, I have never been sick and am actually very healthy. I work out several times a week, have great friends that I hang out with, I love going to clubs and dancing. I have a 6 yo son that I am raising part time and who is a very big part of my life. I volunteer at his school and at a gay youth center. I have never had any serious side effects to the meds I have taken for the last 3.5 years. I have very supportive friends around me some who know my HIV status and some do not, for those who do not, there's no reason for them to know, and I don't see a reason to just walk around telling people.
You and I are not going to ever agree with this and our discussion has moved way past the question as to what a bug chaser is which I think was answered quite well. Believing in bug chasers or them having anything to chase is as un-important to this basic question as believing in Santa or the Easter Bunny, the question was asking for a definiation.
If you would like to discuss this further and go back and forth, why don't you post a new topic because I'm done with this one.
Gregg
Gregg629@aol.com
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If a person you trust and love tells you that they have tested negative for HIV and screws around behind your back having unprotected until they get infected and pass it along to their partner, then that partner has every right to feel betrayed and victimized by that person.
I've been there myself and know exactly what gregg is talking about.
I didn't ask to be HIV positive and didn't willfully put myself at risk. I am certainly not going around with a "woe is me" attitude about it, but nothing will ever change the fact that someone I loved took advantage of my love and trust and betrayed me in an unspeakably horrible way that will affect me until the day I die.
Speaking about how I got it has nothing to do with playing the victim, it has to with the facts of the situation.
I get so tired of self-righteous morons coming onto this board thinking they have some magical insight into the lives of other people and their personalities. You don't know enough about me to have the right to make judgements about me and if you do it anyway, it just goes to show who really has an agenda.
In summation: piss off! I don't require anyone's pity, value judgements, or inane amateur psychoanalysis.
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At least the previous poster did not resort to violent language! Perhaps you anger is an indication that you are moving out of the victim role! Good Luck! Its a challenge to take back our power and claim ALL responsibilty for EVERYTHING that happens to us. Nothing happens by accident. There is a lesson to learn.
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Well thanks to everyone for answering my question and for the interesting dialogue!
Now that I know what the term means, I have to say that I cannot imagine what motivates someone to want to be infected. Wanting to infect is just plain mean and cruel.
Also, what is AIDSrc?
Thanks!
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Gay men seek to be infected because people like gregg and ASO's run around telling gay men how wondrfull the so-called "AIDS medications" are and so they think well hell if I get "infected" all I have to do is go on the drugs. It all kind of back firing on them. There "safe sex campiagns are failing and they are desperate. I don't blame, or condem these men like so many rightious AIDS followers like Gregg do. That hypocritical, nasty and unsupportive!
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gregg629
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Guardian
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Reged: 04/16/01
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Posts: 438
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Loc: Boston
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Anonymous Wrote "Gay men seek to be infected because people like gregg "
So it's my fault that gay men are seeking to become infected. First of all my comments on my drugs was in regard to your comments that taking the meds is harmful and destroys people. I let you know that the drugs are not as bad as you think and that you can take them and still lead a very healthy and happy life without side effects. I will also agree that the press over people living so long and doing so well is back firing, but to blame people who are doing well, living and going on with their lives is beyond belief.
I guess we should all just lay down and die or quit our jobs and live off social security or go homeless rather then lead productive lives.
I also think that there's a difference between someone who dosnt' have fear for HIV because of the meds and Bug Chassers and Gift Givers.
Also I think your the first person who has ever said that I was hypocritical, nasty or unsupportive. I have a few adjectives I could use for people like you, but why.. The body would just replace them with [cencored].
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Greg says: "Also I think your the first person who has ever said that I was hypocritical, nasty or unsupportive. I have a few adjectives I could use for people like you, but why.. The body would just replace them with [cencored]." What do you call that if its not nasty?? People like you are followers who are afraid to stand up to the system. The world needs more leaders who have courage and think for themselves. AIDS drugs will eventually kill you if you stay on them long enough. Sure you might have little "side effects" now but who knows what inernal damage is being done. This is a fact. Of course most people like you will say "oh no its hiv that killed them". Lets see how long your liver stands up to the toxicities. Good luck!
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I don't think your comments are helpful. I just lost my lover of 14 1/2 years about a month ago...he was HIV+ before we met. He went on meds about 4 years ago, and did well until about 1 1/2 yrs ago when he developed Hodgkin's disease, which was actually cured, but his immune system never recovered. WIthout the chemo (which untimately destroyed his weakened immune system, he would have died over a year ago. He had good quality of life until this past fall. THe point of this tangent is he made the choices all along as to whether to take drugs, chemo, etc. I feel that he would have died sooner without them, but that is just my opinion and I wouldn't subject that to anyone else. I don't feel that you should judge Gregg for his choice to take drugs (nor should anyone judge someone's choice not to take drugs). This is hard enough to deal with without being subjected to hostiities and judgements. You are both entitled to your opinions, but in fairness, you put Gregg on the defensive with your judgements of him. WHile "bug chasers" may be in the category you describe of wanting and maybe even glorifying being positive, it is clear from Gregg's own words that this doesn't apply to him. FInally, when both of you start putting labels on each other as belong to certain groups or factions, you are actually making it easier to judge, blame and label, because you no longer see each other as human beings, but as a member of "them". I'm new at this..I wish I had have found this site years ago...It is great to see debate and difference of opinion, but it should not resort to personal attacks.
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Who's judging the "can't do no wrong" Gregg or whatever his/her real name is. The point is that we are bombarded with take the meds they will save, sorry "extend your life" message all the time yet there is not solid quality documents to prove this. Of course its a personal choice and its "my" opion that these drug have killed many people and continue to do so although now it takes longer. What if you helped kill your friend? Ever though of that possibilty? Proabbly not yet I have researched and considered your side I use to actually think like you. This gregg person thinks because he is registered that he is superior and above us all. I say so what its all virtual.
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You ask with your first question, who's judging gregg who can do no wrong, implying that you are not. then later you go on to say he thinks he is suoperior because he is a signed member!!! THAT IS JUDGING!!! There is not one thing I have read in Gregg's messages that he says he is superior. Then you go on to make your point about the meds, which is actually fine, as that is your opinion, and meeds to be made and thought about by anyone considering their choices. My question is, why do you have to make your point,AND then go on to point fingers, at Gregg or me or anyone who might make different points or choices from you?
Take a look at your messages, and take some responsibility for your words. I feel attacked by you now, and you show a great deal of insensitivity, by pointing a finger at me in my lover's death. I have had many sleepless nights going over EVERYTHING (so I did not need you who don't know me, my lover and what we went through, having the insesitivity of asking me if I thought of this possibility), including the meds, etc, but I want to reiterate that it wasn't my chioce. I was there to support my lover when he made choices to fight and when he made the choice to stop fighting. We had friends who decided not to take meds, and use alternative therapies, and guess what? They died as well...I respect their choices and would never be so insensitive and judgmental as to question their lovers or partners on did they think they helped kill them. Unlike you, I don't take sides...I am HIV negative and don't feel that I have any right to question somebody's decision about their health care. You seem very quick to decide what is in other people's heads, and my guess (note, I am identifying this as a hypothesis, not a fact, as you seem to do with others) is that you do this for the very reason that you view the world in sides --yours and not yours, and those who are on "not yours" (in your mind) are against you. Well, my best friend is HIV positive and his views on meds are the same as yours, but you know what? Unlike you, he doesn't judge, blame or condemn those who don't think like him. We have and continue to have many great exchanges about these issues, done with respect for our sometimes different opinions, and not as a way to try to convince the other that he is "wrong" and I am "right", but to echange ideas and hopefully each of us grow in this exchange. Because we are able to do this, our friendship has blossomed and grown as well. It is fine that you feel strongly about your opinions but your way of expressing them and judging others (again, look at you own words, despite your belief you are not) is not helpful, it is hurtful. I do not know if that is your intent, but you have been told in several different ways by several different people. I will not respond to any further of comments written by you in this manner, and I would encourage others to ignore you as well, until you can learn to respond in a manner that repects others' opinions rather than judging and lashing out.
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